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ZT

本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛The educated customer is the best customer 之1: 换窗 (我爱我家)
by xanada(㊣流水), Thursday, October 02, 2008, 14:52

Home renovation的四要素:技术指标/认证,行业协会,manufacture和dealor/contractor

技术指标/认证是事先要做的功课,知道你想要什么样的东西。

行业协会有加入标准,会员的工作质量比较有credit。

manufacture最好是正规厂商,得到行业组织或标准的认可。

dealor/contractor个人认为是最重要的,再好的东西让一个没有经验的人来装,结果是不会好的。
从换窗说起:

一、技术指标/认证

1. 知道energy star

ENERGY STAR is a joint program of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and the U.S. Department of Energy helping us all save money and protect the environment through energy efficient products and practices.

http://www.energystar.gov/

2. 知道window wise

Window Wise is a quality assurance program that gives homeowners the peace of mind that the windows they are installing and the tradespeople installing them are of the
highest quality.

Window Wise independently audits and certifies contractors and window manufacturers, and conducts comprehensive window installation training seminars for installers. This ensures that if your replacement windows are Window Wise, you've made a wise choice. 对于manufactor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须把自己的产品拿去检测并通过。对于dealor/contractor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须去接受培训并通过。

Window Wise 的认证标准比energy wise的更高。也就是说,是window wise的肯定是energy star,但是是energy star不一定是window wise。

Window Wise is a program of S.A.W.D.A.C, the Siding And Window Dealer's Association of Canada.

http://www.windowwise.com/

3. low e 和low e2

简单的说,low e是一种技术,在窗户上抹一个涂层,在基本不减少光通度(Visible Transmittance)的前提下,减低夏天屋外热量的流入,冬天屋内热量的流出(Solar Heat Gain Coefficient),并减低阳光中的uv射线射入量(U-factor)。有了low e,房屋的节能效率会得到明显提升。

low e2(we call it double low e)是一种更牛B的low e,它的硬指标就是把SHGC限制在0.4以内,low e的SHGC是0.58,普通玻璃是0.78。

有兴趣的同学可以去参考如下的两个链接:

High Performance Glazing 里面有一张表,列出了普通玻璃,low e玻璃和low e2玻璃的参数对比,有兴趣深究的同学可以仔细看一看。

http://www.toolbase.org/Technology-Inventory/Windows/high-performance-glass

Costs and Benefits of Low Solar Gain Windows
http://hubpages.com/hub/low_solar_gain_windows

另外,有一种说法,说low e2的窗户对比low e而言,室内光线会黑一些,没有那么亮。但是我们对比两者的VT value,一个是0.78,一个是0.72,并没有什么显著的区别,所以此点就可以忽略不计了。

4. 窗户的种类

窗户有很多种类,花哨的就不说了,你在选购的时候dealor会给你介绍的,这里只讲两种最basic的也是最常用的:

Single slider: 就是两扇推拉的那种

Single slider又分两种:
Single slider lift out 顾名思义,就是可以拿下来的那种。
Single slider tile 拿不下来,因此保温性相对较好。

Casement: 就是开合式的那种

Casement保温性比Single slide要好,尤其适合小窗户,比如卫生间,basement等地方。

二、行业协会S.A.W.D.A.C

At SAWDAC, we set tough standards that our hundreds of member dealers and contractors must live up to. When you choose a registered SAWDAC company, you're choosing quality, professionalism and guaranteed workmanship. Before you sign, be sure to ask, "Are you a member of SAWDAC?"

Almost 50% of the companies that apply for SAWDAC membership are rejected because they simply don't measure up.

http://www.sawdac.com/

三、manufacture

前面已经提到过,对于manufactor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须把自己的产品拿去检测并通过。那么在window wise的网站上,有一页列出了所有合格的manufactor的名单:

http://www.windowwise.com/manufacturers.php

其中比较好的几家有:

North star:http://www.northstarwindows.com

Window city:http://www.windocity.com 窗户全部是double low e,据sales说同等最重,我理解就是自吹用料最足最结实。

Consumer choice:http://www.windowreno.com 价格最贵,质量最好(没用过不知道)
其中不好的有:

Home tech:据说最近投诉比较多
四、dealor/contractor

对于dealor/contractor,首先是去你的local BBB(better business bureau) 网站去查一下,它有没有在BBB的list上,如果是BBB Accredited Businesses则更佳。这个应该是消费者信心的一个基本保证,如果在上面,那么不会差到哪里去,如果不在,你自己决定吧。。。

对于GTA的筒子门来说,BBB的网站是:
http://www.bbbgta.com

接着,你就需要找3家左右来询价比较了,你需要准备一个比较详细的question list

1. are you a registerd entity? do you have WSIB?
大项目要找正规公司,别找干私活的,以后出问题没保障。同样,没有wsib工伤保险,如果施工过程中出了事故,没准儿就得你来负责人的后半辈子

2. how long have you been in this business? how many projects have you completed in last year?
时间愈长项目愈多经验愈丰富

3. do you have a show room?
有show room实地看一下最好

4. will you be using subcontractors on this project?
我找的是你,可不想让你转包给别人来做

5. which manufacture’s product are you using?
是不是在那个window wise提供的信得过list上

6. does you window apply to energy star or window wise?
最好是window wise,最起码也要是energy star

7. are you using low e or double low e?
最好是double low e,最起码也要是low e

8. what’s your double spacer width?
at least .75 or 1 inch

9. do you do the cleaning after all the job done and take all old windows off?

10. do you have any reference?
reference的重要性就不多说了

11. what’s your warranty? is it transferable?
一般来说,是lifetime的glass,5年parts,5年人工,如果能拿到更长的warranty当然更好。warranty是transferable的。

12. decide style (single slide, casement) you want

13. decide you want to change the window only or you want to do a B2B(brick to brick) change.
B2B会贵很多,取决于你的budget。但是记住如果只换窗户,将来frame坏了,还得把窗户再换一遍,所以也要考虑你打算住多少年了。通常的做法是换窗,然后with wood frame coved by heavy duty alumni。

14. negotiate price and payment

五、行动

最后我们选了windowchoice作为contractor:

http://www.windowchoice.ca/

它是BBB Accredited business since 06/09/2005,它通过了window wise和energy star的认证,它是SAWDAC的会员,它用的是window city生产的窗户。满足了我们几乎所有的过滤条件。

说句题外话,上次小饭贴了一个国人兄弟的XX门窗,但它既没有在BBB上列名,也没有energy star或者window wise的认证,也不是SAWDAC的会员,它的manufacture就是它自己,虽然价钱比别人便宜一半,但我还是不敢用,毕竟要是出问题可就太麻烦了。当然我绝对不是说人家的东西不好,就是在它还没有通过相关的认证的时候,作为消费者我不大放心。

省钱还是省心,完全由你自己决定。更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
Report

Replies, comments and Discussions:

  • 枫下家园 / 美丽家居 / 急!急!请大家推荐一下好的门窗公司(想安3层玻璃装窗),多谢了!
    • 我刚装完家里的窗门. 挺好的
      • 请问是哪家公司?质量,价格如何?
        • PM You, did you receive?
          • 谢谢,收到了,可惜那公司不做3层玻璃窗。
      • pm我,也需要。谢了。
      • Could you pls also PM to me. Thanks a lot!
        • PM 了
      • Please PM me. I plan to change windows too...thanks
        • 如果有和他们签了合同的,Pm我,我要叫老板请我吃饭,呵呵. 免费帮他们做广告
      • please PM me,too. Thanks.
      • Please PM me too. Thanks.
      • PM ME PLS
      • PM me 2.. Thanks
      • PM me please, I am going to replace some.
      • can you also pm me? thanks!!!!!!!!!!!
      • Can you PM me too? Thanks.
      • Can you please PM me the company contact? Thanks a lot!
    • 这么多人问,有人换了吗?我还在是retro fit installation,还是brick-to-brick installation之间犹豫不决。retro fit installation便宜些,但听说窗户会显小,请用retro fit installation的前辈指点一下。多些!
      • How much price difference?
        • 2K
      • ZT
        本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛The educated customer is the best customer 之1: 换窗 (我爱我家)
        by xanada(㊣流水), Thursday, October 02, 2008, 14:52

        Home renovation的四要素:技术指标/认证,行业协会,manufacture和dealor/contractor

        技术指标/认证是事先要做的功课,知道你想要什么样的东西。

        行业协会有加入标准,会员的工作质量比较有credit。

        manufacture最好是正规厂商,得到行业组织或标准的认可。

        dealor/contractor个人认为是最重要的,再好的东西让一个没有经验的人来装,结果是不会好的。
        从换窗说起:

        一、技术指标/认证

        1. 知道energy star

        ENERGY STAR is a joint program of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and the U.S. Department of Energy helping us all save money and protect the environment through energy efficient products and practices.

        http://www.energystar.gov/

        2. 知道window wise

        Window Wise is a quality assurance program that gives homeowners the peace of mind that the windows they are installing and the tradespeople installing them are of the
        highest quality.

        Window Wise independently audits and certifies contractors and window manufacturers, and conducts comprehensive window installation training seminars for installers. This ensures that if your replacement windows are Window Wise, you've made a wise choice. 对于manufactor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须把自己的产品拿去检测并通过。对于dealor/contractor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须去接受培训并通过。

        Window Wise 的认证标准比energy wise的更高。也就是说,是window wise的肯定是energy star,但是是energy star不一定是window wise。

        Window Wise is a program of S.A.W.D.A.C, the Siding And Window Dealer's Association of Canada.

        http://www.windowwise.com/

        3. low e 和low e2

        简单的说,low e是一种技术,在窗户上抹一个涂层,在基本不减少光通度(Visible Transmittance)的前提下,减低夏天屋外热量的流入,冬天屋内热量的流出(Solar Heat Gain Coefficient),并减低阳光中的uv射线射入量(U-factor)。有了low e,房屋的节能效率会得到明显提升。

        low e2(we call it double low e)是一种更牛B的low e,它的硬指标就是把SHGC限制在0.4以内,low e的SHGC是0.58,普通玻璃是0.78。

        有兴趣的同学可以去参考如下的两个链接:

        High Performance Glazing 里面有一张表,列出了普通玻璃,low e玻璃和low e2玻璃的参数对比,有兴趣深究的同学可以仔细看一看。

        http://www.toolbase.org/Technology-Inventory/Windows/high-performance-glass

        Costs and Benefits of Low Solar Gain Windows
        http://hubpages.com/hub/low_solar_gain_windows

        另外,有一种说法,说low e2的窗户对比low e而言,室内光线会黑一些,没有那么亮。但是我们对比两者的VT value,一个是0.78,一个是0.72,并没有什么显著的区别,所以此点就可以忽略不计了。

        4. 窗户的种类

        窗户有很多种类,花哨的就不说了,你在选购的时候dealor会给你介绍的,这里只讲两种最basic的也是最常用的:

        Single slider: 就是两扇推拉的那种

        Single slider又分两种:
        Single slider lift out 顾名思义,就是可以拿下来的那种。
        Single slider tile 拿不下来,因此保温性相对较好。

        Casement: 就是开合式的那种

        Casement保温性比Single slide要好,尤其适合小窗户,比如卫生间,basement等地方。

        二、行业协会S.A.W.D.A.C

        At SAWDAC, we set tough standards that our hundreds of member dealers and contractors must live up to. When you choose a registered SAWDAC company, you're choosing quality, professionalism and guaranteed workmanship. Before you sign, be sure to ask, "Are you a member of SAWDAC?"

        Almost 50% of the companies that apply for SAWDAC membership are rejected because they simply don't measure up.

        http://www.sawdac.com/

        三、manufacture

        前面已经提到过,对于manufactor来说,要拿到window wise的认证,必须把自己的产品拿去检测并通过。那么在window wise的网站上,有一页列出了所有合格的manufactor的名单:

        http://www.windowwise.com/manufacturers.php

        其中比较好的几家有:

        North star:http://www.northstarwindows.com

        Window city:http://www.windocity.com 窗户全部是double low e,据sales说同等最重,我理解就是自吹用料最足最结实。

        Consumer choice:http://www.windowreno.com 价格最贵,质量最好(没用过不知道)
        其中不好的有:

        Home tech:据说最近投诉比较多
        四、dealor/contractor

        对于dealor/contractor,首先是去你的local BBB(better business bureau) 网站去查一下,它有没有在BBB的list上,如果是BBB Accredited Businesses则更佳。这个应该是消费者信心的一个基本保证,如果在上面,那么不会差到哪里去,如果不在,你自己决定吧。。。

        对于GTA的筒子门来说,BBB的网站是:
        http://www.bbbgta.com

        接着,你就需要找3家左右来询价比较了,你需要准备一个比较详细的question list

        1. are you a registerd entity? do you have WSIB?
        大项目要找正规公司,别找干私活的,以后出问题没保障。同样,没有wsib工伤保险,如果施工过程中出了事故,没准儿就得你来负责人的后半辈子

        2. how long have you been in this business? how many projects have you completed in last year?
        时间愈长项目愈多经验愈丰富

        3. do you have a show room?
        有show room实地看一下最好

        4. will you be using subcontractors on this project?
        我找的是你,可不想让你转包给别人来做

        5. which manufacture’s product are you using?
        是不是在那个window wise提供的信得过list上

        6. does you window apply to energy star or window wise?
        最好是window wise,最起码也要是energy star

        7. are you using low e or double low e?
        最好是double low e,最起码也要是low e

        8. what’s your double spacer width?
        at least .75 or 1 inch

        9. do you do the cleaning after all the job done and take all old windows off?

        10. do you have any reference?
        reference的重要性就不多说了

        11. what’s your warranty? is it transferable?
        一般来说,是lifetime的glass,5年parts,5年人工,如果能拿到更长的warranty当然更好。warranty是transferable的。

        12. decide style (single slide, casement) you want

        13. decide you want to change the window only or you want to do a B2B(brick to brick) change.
        B2B会贵很多,取决于你的budget。但是记住如果只换窗户,将来frame坏了,还得把窗户再换一遍,所以也要考虑你打算住多少年了。通常的做法是换窗,然后with wood frame coved by heavy duty alumni。

        14. negotiate price and payment

        五、行动

        最后我们选了windowchoice作为contractor:

        http://www.windowchoice.ca/

        它是BBB Accredited business since 06/09/2005,它通过了window wise和energy star的认证,它是SAWDAC的会员,它用的是window city生产的窗户。满足了我们几乎所有的过滤条件。

        说句题外话,上次小饭贴了一个国人兄弟的XX门窗,但它既没有在BBB上列名,也没有energy star或者window wise的认证,也不是SAWDAC的会员,它的manufacture就是它自己,虽然价钱比别人便宜一半,但我还是不敢用,毕竟要是出问题可就太麻烦了。当然我绝对不是说人家的东西不好,就是在它还没有通过相关的认证的时候,作为消费者我不大放心。

        省钱还是省心,完全由你自己决定。更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net